Actually, that is a great idea… but would increase the price significantly. I have been looking to integrate oled momentary switches into some woodworking projects (for the fun of it because I am a geek). they have some very high res screens the size of dice, and a few mm thick… would not be too hard to integrate them into the paddles, but it would look a little off (unless you use black paddles, there would be a dark square block in the middle of the paddle)
1 Like
True, but I was being basic. In reality, there is already feedback with all the paddle switches, the (compared to some other switches) very solid click feedback.
1 Like
I’m not a fan of the idea of using paper labels or stickers… even if you place it under a clear plastic tab of sorts… it just looks cheap… and cheesy…
That said… maybe creating standard set of buttons with etched icons that can be swapped in or out would work, maybe some blanks for people like me… who may or may not have a CNC router in his garage… and soon… a CO2 laser (if I can convince my wife).
Her biggest complaint, like someone else mentioned, is having to remember scene tap sequences. She likes to point to my brother in laws house, which has a ton of those 5 and 6 button Lutron Casata switches… Good thing I do the wiring… she does not have much choic
e 
Another idea I had today … if you put buttons inset on the inside, or even had a rotary button that transfers force from horizontal motion to vertical motion, you could have a faux rotary controller. This would be awesome for media control on a wall!
1 Like
First of all, this is amazing. Exactly what I’d want in a couple locations in the house.
For feedback, I’d like to echo everything Chris said about Operation modes. That would be amazing. Something to think about for the future: for his mode 2, I’d almost want to see that in a separate, larger product. I’m envisioning a double wide decora panel as a sort of central control switch. It has 6 or 9 buttons, and works like Chris described. That functionality in a three button switch might be a little less intuitive when switching between triple and quadruple clicks to select a particular device you want to then control with the dimmer controls below. Still, a great option for power users, which I think is 90% of the forum.
Form factor: I think an LED bar that matches the existing Reds would be first choice like Chris said. A switch that blends in with existing switches would look the least jarring (which is super important), though you might lose a little functionality with the smaller LEDs to represent the scenes. I think it’s probably fine though.
Alternatively, I think kreene1987’s middle example is also great. It gives an led for the dimmer like existing switches (which can hopefully be lit up partially in the same way), while having configurable simple on off LEDs for the scene switches. Sharp, functional, though it doesn’t match existing switches, which might look a little jarring to people (and SOs) who want things to look tidy.
One thing I’d highlight though is the bottom buttons being two different buttons. If they’re instead designed as a small sideways rocker, it’s more intuitive that they are an on off switch/dimmer, rather than unrelated buttons. This matters with houseguests and less technically savvy family members. I think a modular button approach like has been mentioned could allow for two buttons rather than a rocker, but that should likely be aftermarket like the custom buttons (which are a great idea, btw).
All in all, this is an amazing product idea, especially with the ability to customize the buttons display. If you can figure out a way to make that not after market and still not look chintzy, I’d be one happy camper. Also, I imagine these won’t be as ubiquitous in the home as regular switches and dimmers, so a slightly more premium price would probably make sense, rather than losing functionality.
Along the lines of increased functionality motion is a good idea. I almost ordered the GE motion sensing zwave switches. However, given how cheap existing motion sensors are, and the fact that these switches likely won’t be put throughout the home, but only in certain locations, I’m not sure the added expense of a motion detector is worth it.
…though I’d still probably buy it. Looking forward to whatever you guys come up with!
An addendum: those aftermarket buttons with common etchings would be really great low level purchases with points in the new rewards program you guys are planning.
So I’m digging this design.
I have been waiting for a good scene selection switch that my wife will use(she can never remember how many clicks up or down for some things. I’m limited to two clicks up and two down on a switch to program for her, the rest of the click combinations are for me).
I look forward to buying these next year!
Things to agree on that I like above:
- Associations!
- Ability to turn-off all the lights on the switch/ change the settings on them (same as current switches)
- customizable buttons (even for the dimmer buttons)
I just got a bunch of the Red Dimmer Switches and your fan controller and trying to find the time to install them.
Awesome work!!! I love the outreach!
1 Like
Love the idea. There aren’t many/any good Z-Wave keypads on the market. A couple comments:
- Make sure to analyze the form and capabilities of Lutron seeTouch keypads. These are the gold standard comparison. They’re way overpriced but they end up being worth it IMO. And note they include 1 round of engraving in the cost of the device.
- What functional capabilities does the 700 series chipset give you compared to the 500? Paired with a 700 series hub. So far I’ve seen no real functionality improvements in 700 series devices. I know there aren’t many available now. Silicon Labs has pushed the more capability line, maybe an opportunity for you to be a first mover.
These look cool! I assume manual control will be like your other dimmers where holding the switch will increase/decrease brightness?
I’d also like to see a mock-up of @drphungky idea with making the bottom buttons look like a rocker. Anything that makes it easier to use for non-techy people is a win in my book (even though we all know smart rockers are just two buttons behind the rocker 
).
Thanks for the detailed responses.
Just looked at the sticker on the back, and it actually is a rebranded Leviton IWC600. It was designed to have a load directly connected to it, but I did not have a load connected to it, I just used it as a scene controller. There was a setting to disable the load which freed up all four buttons to be used as scene controllers. Manual here: INSTALLATION & USER GUIDE - PDF Free Download
Looks like you can still nab one off ebay: https://www.ebay.com/c/1200008019 Or I can send you mine for free if you wanted to play around with it. I replaced it with a Inovelli Red Series last year.
Freaking genius.
Ditto.
Well, @anon14959390 will have job security for a long time with these suggestions lol. This forum is awesome!
A couple design thoughts:
The Caesta is an amazing switch, and its design is definitely sexy and simple, yet the biggest non-nerds complaint is that the buttons are small and you often hit the wrong ones easily. As much as I love the idea of an 8 button scene controller, it might only appeal to seasoned smarthomers who actually have 8 scenes to run!
I imagine most smarthome newbies will have only 3 scenes for the most part: Home, Away and Sleep. So having the top 3 buttons as large as they are makes sense to me, and the bottom 2 smaller would work to make control of individual lights distinctive.
I think these modular ideas are amazing! It would be awesome to have that! But I also think those ideas might be better for 2nd gen of this switch. There is a lot of programming and tech going into a small space, so I would suggest making a great product that might not be as complicated, and add more functions to gen 2 once the backbone is solid.
I think another thing that is really showing up in this chat, but should be pointed out again is your guys branding. Your LED strip is definitely a huge part of what makes you recognizable! So moving forward with switches this might be a good time to maybe pick 1 or 2 other recognizable characteristics, like a distinctive light bulb shape etching on the buttons, a unique haptic feel, or a unique “click” sound to stand out even more, or that catches attention of a stranger using it.
I think swappable switches is awesome, but maybe just get a small set of varieties, It also appeals to newbies. Also outsourcing the to a 3rd party might be a great way to cross promote, especially if you get one who works with contractors or wholesalers.
Love this. Maybe horizontal bottom led?
Ecobee Switch+ is nice, it not only motion detects but it also has a built in night light. Having a switch that auto turns on is awesome.
Maybe an option could be giving out designs to 3D print buttons?
Lurkers are awesome!
New member here, very interested in this project. Lots of good ideas on this thread, I have a couple of thoughts:
Load vs. no-load setup
Would it be possible to install and configure this without a local load, as a pure scene controller? The dimmer buttons could dim the active scene(s).
The use case for this is, my house has a bunch of old PCS UPB 6-button controllers. I really appreciated their convenience but some of them have stopped working and something like this would be great for a retrofit.
Scene vs zone control
I know this is planned to be a scene controller but I think adding zone capability - allowing more than one scene to be active at the same time - would dramatically increase your applicable use cases. I know this would require some thinking around what happens when a device is part of multiple scenes but I think that can be worked around with a config flag.
The old Smarthome Keypadlinc had an option where you could buy clear buttons and have your own printed labels for each key
See here and if go to the “Manuals” section, you can also download various labels they actually provide pre-printed when you purchase the kit:
In addition, you can also replace the default white LED difuser with colored ones that allows you to customize the LED backlit color for each button
https://us.amazon.com/Insteon-2401L-Change-KeypadLinc-4-Color/dp/B0007N7274
This is a very good point. The more I think about this, the more I think the LED bar (and maybe config button too) should stay and put the buttons where the paddle currently is. (That saves on injection molding costs too… heh). Maybe dump the config button and have the bar go all the way bottom to top? Then it can be the status light for all 4 rows of buttons. But that LED bar really is distinctive; I think it should be kept if at all possible.
Maybe the option is have a light on the button to show the button is active, and then keep the big LED bar to show the level it’s at? Or segment the LED bar to be the status light for each row of buttons.
@Eric_Inovelli Very excited about the scene controller, however, will this project come at the expense of Project Windy City? Many of us have been waiting a long time for independent fan switches and I’d hate to learn new ideas (and to be clear, Rock Out is one I absolutely love) are taking precedent over existing projects like Windy City.
Outside of that concern, I love so much of the feedback community has provided already.
-
Labeling the buttons would be critical and I’d much prefer an etched version vs stickers. #WAF would significantly fall if it came with a sticker pack. AND if you do figure out etching…then you can potentially offer it retroactively to your other lineup of switches. I have roughly 30 inovelli red series (mix of dimmers and switches) throughout my house and would LOVE to swap out the paddles in a few rooms that have multi-gang boxes with etched paddles to identify which switch is which.
-
+1 to the idea around incorporating music controls. Would be great to pair with my sonos system.
1 Like
The stickers would be a “no-go” for me as well. Only because my OCD would ‘eerk’ me if I saw a sticker was slightly tilted…I know “just don’t put them on tilted” answers are coming, but sometimes static makes the sticker cling to product quicker than you’d like…
1 Like
Man, I don’t check this for 1 day and look at all these suggestions! It’s gonna take me a minute to check all these out. Hol’ up!
Hey all – echoing @anon14959390, love all the engagement and ideas! There’s so many and it’s got our heads spinning over here with excitement! This is exactly why we love this community
We’re going to take this and talk through a couple of the points (likely tomorrow as today has been a long one!)
One thing we’re wrestling with is the LED bar. Some thoughts/questions below.
Do we keep it to match our existing paddle switches, or since this is a new design (ie: not paddle, but flat), do we move to a different design? What’s driving this question is that we’re going to launch a paddle remote and 5-Button remote and on either, we will not be able to put that long 7-LED bar as it would kill the battery (unless we have some sort of wireless charging, but we’re not sure on that yet).
The paddle remote will match our On/Off switch LED Bar (ie: one LED).
In addition, I’ve learned from @EricM_Inovelli that the chipset can only handle 7 LED’s without adding a separate MCU. So, if we put the long bar on the side, we would have to add an additional MCU to support the indicator scene buttons (as well as the backlit buttons).
So, the argument for adding the LED Bar is that it would match current aesthetics and from a brand/marketing standpoint, our, “distinctive assets”. It would also show the level at which the light is dimmed and would be a large canvas to depict notifications.
The argument against it is that it would drive the cost up by adding in an additional MCU and 7 more LED’s. It also wouldn’t match the remote that we want to put out later.
Curious to hear everyone’s thoughts around this!
2 Likes
Would the individual LEDs have individually assignable brightness? If so, 7 separate LEDs could still indicate individual brightness, potentially giving more information at a glance.