Z-Wave 800 Series Motion Switch | Project Linus (Red Series)

So Hot Right Now Projects & Roadmaps
#8

Awesome, and a Spartan’s fan? Nice!

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I’m going to preface the answers in that they’re the best I have at this time but they’re subject to change (hopefully not, but just need to cover myself lol).

Yeah absolutely (this one I’m confident on).

This I’m not sure on. It’s supposed to detect a millimeter’s worth of movement. So, in theory, if they’re moving in their sleep it should trigger it. I know some have breathing detection, but I don’t think that will be possible with this switch.

However, I’m not sure what will be picked up if someone is completely still for 8hrs lol.

This is the challenge… unfortunately mmWave (and PIR) detects animals and has no way of differentiating it. I think PIR may be able to do a better job due to the lower temperature in some animals, but it’s still not the best.

Our solve for this would be to create zones that can be excluded. For instance, if you have a dog that’s 3ft high, you’d exclude the bottom row of detection from the sensor. Obviously you wouldn’t be able to account for if the dog jumps, but that’s something we’ll have to explore a solution on.

Similarly with ceiling fans, we’d set an exclusion zone at the top of the room to not pick up the spinning blade.

Correct regarding the scene question. Unfortunately, this is an area Z-Wave struggles in (bulbs) and associations to those bulbs.

I would recommend using Zigbee for the areas you have Philips bulbs for the best performance with smart bulbs. We may come out with a Z-Wave version, but if we did, it would be after a Zigbee version is launched as it’s just much cheaper to build and the market has more opportunity unfortunately.

That’s a great question that I haven’t heard in a while actually! I don’t think we’d do anything like that, however, simply because I don’t think there’s much room left on the PCB to add an additional radio without significantly impacting the depth of the switch.

Plus, while some people would spend extra, it would probably add at least $10 to the switch MSRP and I think we’re already at a premium cost that it would be hard to attract new customers that are more price sensitive.

It’s something we can look into though. I’m all for optimizing and not having a ton of SKU’s.

Yeah I’m definitely camp Lux. There are also a lot of B2B companies that are getting into circadian lighting that would love to have a switch with lux in it to better automate that.

Our only reason for not promising it right now is space on the PCB. I’m hoping we can get it in there though.

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#9

This could be really cool. A Z-Wave switch (controlled by a Z-Wave hub) bound to Zigbee bulbs. You’d have the best of both world’s then.

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#10

ahhh man can you imagine all the HA users reporting radio issues for not just one but two per device?

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#11

Well with 2 radios, it’s probably 4x the problems.

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#12

They can call it Project 4x. You guys are supposed to be on my side and help get this made, not scare it out of existence. :laughing:

#13

Project Update:

As we’re only $10k from the goal, we made the decision to move forward with this project officially! I seem to keep underestimating everyone’s enthusiasm for Z-Wave which I need to work on apparently haha. I set the $325k as a stretch goal and gave us a month to accomplish it and you guys essentially nailed it within a couple days!

I sent out a project update via Indiegogo about next steps, but I’ll also post them here:

  • I will be emailing everyone to see if you’re a member of our community and, if so, would you like me to activate the community flair that comes along with the perk you purchased
  • I will be reaching out to the people who purchased the, “Automatic Beta Testing” perk and getting you setup in our system
  • We will be finalizing the deposit to the manufacturer to kick things off and discussing a few outstanding questions we have around mmWave Zones and how we’ll accomplish this
  • I will be updating the community threads - I encourage everyone to check these out and comment when applicable as this is where we get our ideas, we discuss solutions, etc - This is your place to voice your opinion and shape the project:

Congratulations everyone, we’re really looking forward to this project and seeing where it takes us as a community!

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#14

Jumped on a 5 pack over the weekend. Very happy to see that the stretch goal will be met. I’ll eventually need a couple regular on/off switches that are scene capable (controlling wall outlets so technically can’t use dimmers) but these will hold me over until I can find/grab on/off switches.

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#15

In for just the one, because I can’t find use for more than one or two without programmable zones (and the house is already filled with Inovelli Reds and PIR sensors, controlled with Entity Controller on HA). Very happy for Inovelli and hope the continuing enthusiasm means more success for the team and the continuation of awesome products for the smart home community. :heart:

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#16

I’ve been waiting for an 800 series version of that other device - I’m so glad you guys are doing it. I could only get 1 for now, but over time I’ll be getting 4-5 more! Thankyou!

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#17

Wish that I could buy in on a few of these, but my cardiologist does not want me near any mmWave stuff like this and BMI-measuring scales because the RF will cause problems with my pacemaker per the manufacturer…

#18

I’d go back to the manufacturer and see what’s power levels EIRP/frequencies are acceptable because there’s quite a few mmWave technologies out in the public today.

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#19

FR here!
Can we make this (and I guess any other new zwave products) support association to turn on/off the light portion of the LZW36? If it’s a different chip or something required NM, but if it’s just firmware…

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#20

It is absolutely a hard NO to mmWave exposure. Sadly, they replaced my old ticker box last month when the batteries ran low…and they installed the same ancient model device because of some compatibility problem with my heart condition. Modern units are much more tolerant, and can even be used in some MRI machines. I now have another 7-10 years stuck with this ancient implanted clunker… :roll_eyes:

#21

Interesting, so not even frequency dependent? Couldn’t put it in a faraday cage before inserting in the chest? :slight_smile:

#22

The manufacturer of the implanted gadget goes as far as to specify where/how a cell phone can be carried or used, in addition to prohibiting use of health scales that use mmWave to estimate BMI. Since I have no natural heart beat and will die if the device fails, you can take it to the bank that I am following their guidelines to the letter…

#23

Oof…I hope the person who built your device was on their “A” game that day. Makes complete sense and totally understand.

#24

Vreihen,

Can you get me the brand and model? Even just brand would be great. Id like to reach out to them. I am in close contact with many of these reps professionally and would love to shed more kight here for the community.

Agree with the poster below as well. Not medical advice*

#25

First and foremost this is not medical advice. The concern regarding devices (pacemakers and defibrillators) is electromagnetic interference where the device falsey believes you are having a heart rhythm when you aren’t (pacemaker) or having a fast heart rhythm that needs treatment when you don’t (defibrillator). Mmwave is in the gigahertz bandwith, too fast to be in the physiologic spectrum and in the filtered spectrum of the device. In the case of cell phone placement in relation to your device it’s over the concern for case reports causing the reed switch to switch with the magnet in some cell phones (the latest iphone) which changed settings. As always, advice of your implanting physician is most important but if you don’t have an electrophysiologist it may be worth to find one and discuss with them. This is not meant to be medical advice.

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#26

What is (or will be) inovelli’s Z-Wave solution for non-light applications? E.G. Fans, outlets, ballasts (magnetic or electric) or any inductive/motorized loads?

#27

Crossposting here from the Zigbee thread

Project Update: We’re hitting some red tape with Indiegogo and releasing the funds, but fingers crossed that will work itself out this week. Once it happens, we will make the downpayment on the materials as well as start paying the NRE fees (Non-Refundable Engineering).

In the meantime, I wanted to share the speed of mmWave as I know this was an initial concern when we were reading about it in the forums and on Reddit. I don’t think I ever shared this with you all, but here’s a quick video of the motion/presence detection:

This is just an off-the-shelf 24GHz sensor that I put up next to a light switch to simulate as best as I could how the sensor would work.

In the video, you’ll see me poke around the corner as I just wanted to share what the setup looked like and the proximity it was to me. Then I walk through at a normal pace.

As you can see, the lights are near instant. There is a slight delay, but I’m attributing that to the fact that I have the sensor connected to Home Assistant and the bulbs are connected to the Hue gateway, so there is some jumps the signal has to go through. Still, very fast – faster then I could reach over to the light switch to turn the light on.

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@EricM_Inovelli has been testing this in greater detail for quite some time and has it setup to detect his motion when he comes in the room and the light turns on and then on the way out, he has the sensor detect the lack of presence and wait 15 seconds before turning off the light. He says it has never failed and has been impressed.

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The manufacturers are suggesting a more customized solution, but we’ve been using this as a benchmark in our discussions.

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