Two of my Blue switches are controlling bathroom fans. One of them is fine, but the other one is behaving very unreliably. When the switch is turned on, one of these things happens:
The fan turns on normally and everything is fine
The fan makes a strange noise as if the switch is applying dimming (I obviously have it in relay mode)
When the latter happens, then:
The noise continues until I turn it off
The switch reboots itself and then the noise resumes until I turn it off
The switch shuts down completely and I need to pull the air gap to get it to come back on (after which it boots up and the noise resumes until I turn it off
Like I said, I have the switch in relay mode, and this isn’t a crazy high power fan or anything. About 50W. My first guess is that the switch is defective and I should open a ticket, but if anyone else has any insight, please let me know.
Blue series 2N1 are not rated for motor loads regardless of wattage. You’re going to want to use the upcoming fan switch for the bath fan. I have a couple that I kept dumb switches installed just for bath fans because the 2N1 did not power it correctly.
I also tried on a small ceiling fan and it flashes the light (which causes color changes) when I hooked it up to one (even in smart bulb mode). These are just not rated for this type of load.
Ehhhhh technically the relay isn’t in line. The relay is for the dumb switch traveler connection. Everything is going through the dimming mosfet and the sine wave is being clipped, so that is most likely causing the issue.
Not to say you don’t have a defective switch, but just stating the switch was not approved for motoring loads.
Early on, it was the intention of the 2 in 1 to have true switch functionality, hence Eric’s comment about the fan. However ultimately, the switch did not wind up being designed it that way.
The 2 in 1 does not have UL certification for fan load use.
I understand that it’s not certified, and I have now read part of the thread linked by @harjms so I understand why it doesn’t work when it seems like it should. Seems odd to call it a 2-in-1 at this point, since it’s really just a dimmer.
I agree. I’m not sure Inovelli got what they asked for from the manufacturer on this product. It simulates a switch in a neutral config, but Mosfets are always powered and it’s not a clean sine wave in switch mode.
@Eric_Inovelli Can you provide some clarification here? I know this has been hashed out elsewhere. But, since it worked out this way, is there any plan to introduce a switch with a TRUE relay for on/off operations? Any plans to change marketing or clarify the difference. I can easily see people assuming a “switch” should be capable of powering on/off loads up to the wattage rating properly, when that is clearly not the case. I doubt people will dive into the nuts/bolts of which UL rating was applied for or received.
Does this limitation ALSO apply to the upcoming Blue Fan switch… or does that have a relay that will pass the true sine wave and thus be capable of properly handling on/off loads expecting full voltage?
What about the upcoming 800 series switch?
I really think you should drop the 2-in-1 marketing/naming if the switch isn’t going to operate like other on/off switches are and how customers expect they should.
You weren’t the only one confused by this. I thought it had an actual relay controlling the load as well. Only after receiving them did I notice that was dropped from the design.
Yeah, and at this point, I think Inovelli should revisit the decision to try for an all-in-one SKU. It was a nice idea, but it didn’t work out. There are a lot of use cases out there where a true on/off is needed. For instance, knowing what I know now, I wouldn’t want to attempt connecting a 2-in-1 to a switched outlet, which is a common use case for a smart on/off.
I don’t disagree about splitting SKUs, but not because of switched outlets. At least in the US, you can’t use an Inovelli switch (even a Red/Black) to a switch receptacle and be NEC compliant. The electrical code requires that a switch used with a receptacle be capable of carrying the maximum amperage of the breaker. Since this is typically 15A (possibly 20A), Inovellis and most other smart switches don’t even come close to meeting that requirement.
There is one obscure exception where a special receptacle and plug are used that won’t allow you to plug a regular plug into the switched portion of the receptacle, but I’ve never seen one of these IRL.
Leviton’s On/Off Smart switches are rated at 15A.
They are using a relay to control the load, so I see no reason why being a smart switch would make them inherently unable to handle the amperage. Now, if they are attempting it through a dimmer mechanism, like Inovelli is, I understand.
Leviton offers the same switch in Zwave and Zigbee, that also support 15A. I had the Zwave versions in my last home.
The point was that a smart switch on an on/off outlet is possible… and in fact, I would say that it almost shouldn’t be marketed as an on/off if it can’t support a 15A switched receptable (among other common use cases that typically have loads higher than lighting)
I wouldn’t agree with that. I’m guessing that the overwhelming majority of Inovelli Red/Black switch installations are working just fine controlling wired loads, with many satisfied users. To say that those switches shouldn’t have been marketed as on/off switches is just ridiculous.
I agree that I wouldn’t say that based on their load capacity, but they are absolutely not on/off switches because the dimmer can’t be bypassed. They don’t turn fans on and off correctly, and probably other loads too. If there has ever been any other smart dimmer marketed as an on/off switch, I’m not aware of it.
The 2-1 name (dimmer AND on/off together) carried over when it was originally spec’ed to have a relay to control the load. I had plans to use several of them in a relay capacity but once they finally arrived realized they aren’t capable. One of my use cases was for ballasted lamps. Sadly I also sold several of the black and red on/offs I had held back for that same purpose.
Not really what you want to hear… but you could install a smart relay, and then use the switch to trigger the relay (disable onboard switching, and just have the switch signal to Home Assistant or whatever to trigger the relay)
There are, indeed, many ways of working around a product that doesn’t work as advertised. However, adding a second relay to work with a switch advertised as a 2-in-1 dimmer and on/off switch shouldn’t be necessary.
